we need to talk about kevin book reddit

I have caught up and seen many horror movies this year but one of the most realistic horror movies I have seen recently is "We Need To Talk About Kevin". That as awful as Kevin is, the parents are awful too, and maybe enabled his violence through their bullshit? We Need to Talk About Kevin is a 2003 novel by Lionel Shriver, published by Serpent's Tail, about a fictional school massacre. If so, to what degree? I do think he's evil, but what made him that way is intriguing. On the note of "people are born this way", check out the documentary "Child of Rage" - it explores that further and is very interesting. ... Eva; we know that Kevin killed several classmates and a teacher at his school when he was just shy of 16yo. She has also written for the Guardian, Financial Times, Wall Street Journal, and the Economist. One of the hardest things was that nobody believed me about how mean he could be because he was absolutely charming to everyone else. I knew he didn't. Father's bond with their children typically months after they are born, so can we call a father evil if he hasn't yet bonded with his child? Book Discussion Questions: We Need to Talk About Kevin by Lionel Shriver. FREE delivery: Sep 4 - 5 on your first eligible order to UK or Ireland. The very ending of the book is odd after she visits Kevin in prison, do you agree? Eva and Franklin both had major short-comings as parents, and there was a definite lack of attention from the doctors as they are typically the ones we hope/expect to pick up on certain behaviors as well. Press J to jump to the feed. However, most serial killers had a fucked up childhood, so they are also made. Is that within their control? reddit has ruined me towards the name kevin. I think it was purposeful. New comments cannot be posted and votes cannot be cast. That was behind my choice to read it again. Received this wishlist book in the mail today. We Need to Talk About Kevin (2011) - who is the fucked up one here? Cause if not she has a good reason to be cold after that little shit. I'm going to be starting The Hobbit, followed by the Lord Of The Rings and then maybe read the first Dune book. The scene I am referring to is last scene where Tilda Swinton's character, Eva, finally has a breakthrough with Kevin. Did Stephanie ever talk about the movie "We Need To Talk About Kevin"? Furthermore, if one doesn't bond with your child, for whatever reason, can they fake it? They’re mad you didn’t do something about your son that was clearly a threat given what you noticed. Therefore, she gets mad at Kevin. Who says if he wasn't abused everything would be okay. We Need to Talk About Kevin is the 8th novel by Lionel Shriver. I hate Kevin the first time I read the book and almost sided with the mother. Cookies help us deliver our Services. It's a weird narrative though if you know anything about very selfish abusive people though, aren't they introspective and they lie to themselves so they never have to feel the guilt she did. I can see I'm in a minority here but … Her pre-baby self is superior and self absorbed. The school disagreed and required me to have him tested. I changed his school and his "ADD" disappeared. 6 - what role does the narrative style, that being Eva recounting Kevin's life and detailing her guilt and admitting everything she did wrong, influence our perception of Eva's responsibility? Lionel Shriver’s novel We Need to Talk About Kevin features a ripped-from-the … Maybe the abuse push him to do this in an early age. People always ignore the warning songs because it “won’t happen to them”. I know there are quite a few subs on Reddit about this movie, but they are old and I really want to say something about the movie that I was thinking about when watching it the whole time. Last Updated on October 26, 2018, by eNotes Editorial. Can we think poorly of a mother who doesn't bond with their child? She is so self-aggrandizing and cold, he is so callous and pushy. Pick up your parcel at a time and place that suits you. Sep 29, 2012 09:58PM. 17 questions answered. If I had done anything wrong, it seemed to me that I had already been punished roundly. 4 - what role do Kevin's doctors and teachers have? The most interesting parts in the novel for me (although it's been about a year since I've read it) were precisely when there was a very thin line between the way Eva behaved and the way Kevin behaved, for she could certainly be as calculating as he (though we … I’m really struggling with this one. I saw another person assess Eva as being the only one who never underestimated Kevin. In her letters, Eva takes us back through her life...and life with Kevin. She won the 2005 Orange Prize for her eighth published novel, We Need to Talk About Kevin, a thriller and close study of maternal ambivalence, and the role it might have played in the title character's decision to murder nine people at his high school. Eva is incredibly unlikeable, but I do feel bad for her considering how much she lost in the end. Is that the point of the book? Told through letters written by Kevin's mother Eva, to her former husband Franklin, Eva's letters are a form of therapy, and an attempt to gain an understanding of her son's innate hatred for the world. WE NEED TO TALK ABOUT KEVIN Lionel Shriver . The format is a series of letters written by Eva Khatchadourian to her absent husband, Franklin, which are a sort of analytical reminiscence about their lives before the arrival of their... Read More. I just totally didn’t remember how awful the parents were in that book. The first school made the problem worse, the second school was a miracle. Eva was definitely the only one who saw Kevin for who he really was. ... We Need to Talk About Kevin. [Spoilers] Just watched We Need to Talk About Kevin for the first time. But I think the point is how powerless everyone in the situation is and how hard it will be to prevent things like this from happening. I think you are on to something though with your point about the narrative style influencing our perception. We spent hours, over days, having tests done. We Need To Talk About Kevin by Lionel Shriver 400pp, Counterpoint Press, £19.50 . We Need to Talk About Kevin. If we had the same narrative style from a different character and knew their innermost thoughts, would we place more responsibility on them? I think everyone is to blame, but I can't assess the majority of where it lies. Leadtext: Dear Franklin, I'm unsure why one trifling incident this afternoon has moved me to write to you. We Need To Talk About Kevin (Serpent's Tail Classics) Paperback – 29 April 2010. This is a moderated subreddit. in regards to the percentage of responsibility each character has for Kevin's massacre. So, was the school responsible? It’s been years since I’ve read that book tho. See what your friends are reading. Press question mark to learn the rest of the keyboard shortcuts. It’s been a while since I’ve read it but is the mom an asshole before Kevin comes along? The degree to which is what I find really interesting. I knew it was hyper-vigilance (feeling unsafe and therefore unable to concentrate because he was always scanning for threats). Books seldom feel as contemporary as this one. Was Kevin truly born like that, or did Eva's fear and lack of attachment to him over the course of his life, until the very very end of the book, cause/exacerbate the lack of emotional bond that caused him to lack empathy for other people? By using our Services or clicking I agree, you agree to our use of cookies. "We Need to Talk About Kevin" is a very accomplished novel about a woman who gave birth to one of America's most infamous high school killers. That also brings into question, in the movie more-so than in the book, if Kevin was really evil and Eva saw him for what he was, or if it was her perception and her projecting it on him made him who he was via a lack of parental bond. The question about nature vs. nurture has gone on for a long time, and I think killers are both born and made. Real “bad seed”vibes. I remember believing the mother was an awful human being as well. Early on in the book, we know that Kevin is in prison, convicted of murdering nine people (seven classmates, a teacher and a cafeteria worker) in his school gym. We Need to Talk About Kevin expands to more theaters this week. Yes and no. I'm also reading, along with my fictional book of choice, non-fiction to scratch my itch to learn about various subjects. Can we think poorly of a mother who doesn't bond with their child? We Need To Talk About Kevin By Lionel Shriver (Harper Perennial, Paperback, 9780062119049, November 2011, 432pp.) By using our Services or clicking I agree, you agree to our use of cookies. I'm starting this topic because I recently got into a discussion about this on another sub and pretty much no one agrees with my interpretation of the movie at all, which is that mom is a psychopath. So far my goal for the year is 12 books (as opposed to zero per year) and I'm already 4 books in. Michelle Wright 2 August 2005. In MRI scans of a normal person vs someone with antisocial personality disorder, there are differences, so they can be born. I think Kevin was both born and made, but the degree of which is what I really enjoy discussing. 1 - does Kevin have the majority of the blame because we are responsible for our actions? Kevin is the most guilty. To me, the most heartbreaking scene is the very last scene. I don't think so, so I definitely agree with your points here. The first time I read it, I was horrified by the violence of Kevin. flag. This quote early in the book is a good introduction to the reasons for blame. Just finished this book… Based on the best-selling novel of the same name, We Need to Talk About Kevin explores nature vs. nurture on a We Need to Talk About Kevin … I must have been angry. Did they perhaps notice developmental issues and not inform his parents? Press question mark to learn the rest of the keyboard shortcuts. Browse Recommendations; Choice Awards; Genres; Giveaways; New Releases The Short of It: If you are already a parent, this book will make you count your blessings but if you have yet to become one, beware...this book will scare the hell out of you and could quite possibly… Is that within their control? I think answering those can determine how much we can blame Eva-- or was he born like that? I ignored most of the Columbine coverage because I was a high schooler at the time and things were awful enough already, but is this a non-funny satire of self-absorbed parents of school shooters? Kevin ignores Eva and makes her feel bad. I deleted it as I was worried about privacy, but I'm very appreciative of … But wow the mother and father are both so awful in their own ways. Update- I didn’t realize that she uses the “r” word as an insult in the book. I am not a parent (nor do I want to be one) so I cannot speak from experience. I don't like Eva, but I think Shriver chose her for the narrative because you get to see how much of her abuse does have influence, but also how ridiculous the level of blame by the locals is as well. I don't know about the blame part. SPOILER WARNING: These book discussion questions are highly detailed and will ruin plot points, if you have not read the book. In true "when your only tool is a hammer, ever problem looks like a nail", the school insisted he had ADD/ADHD. Details. The book created a lot of controversy, and achieved success through word of mouth. Can you fake that unconditional love and acceptance? Because there are people who are full-fledged psychopaths who don't kill or commit any crimes, despite it being their nature. Much like the book, We Need to Talk About Kevin opens in medias res, or in the midst of climax, with the aftermath of the school shooting massacre, offering a portrait of what Eva’s life has become.Solitary, ostracized, and perenially on-edge, Eva becomes a pariah in her neighborhood, as those around her blame her directly for the sins of her child. Posted April 17, 2013 by MPPL. If so, should they have? Ultimately, the film does not give as much insight on Kevin as the book, instead relying solely on Eva's perspective of memories while the book allows a much more complete picture of all the flashbacks, most likely pieced together by Eva's investigation of Kevin's actions, however I felt this was still a very interesting isolated character study and worked well for the … Really interested to hear people's thoughts on this book. Summary: We Need to Talk About Kevin explores the factious relationship between a mother and her evil son. Ik this is an old comment, but how are things now with the child? Lionel Shriver's We Need To Talk About Kevin is an elegant exploration of guilt, says Zoë Green Zoë Green Sat 26 Feb 2005 20.05 EST First published on Sat 26 Feb 2005 20.05 EST But are all killers in general made or born? Lol thank you, I think about the book a lot and the more I do the more layers come to mind. She kind of is an asshole. by Francene (new) - rated it 1 star. Franklin (though shown to be a cuddly guy in the movie) didn't see Kevin as he really was and wanted Kevin to be different, looking for his ideal son. Can we think poorly of anyone if nothing is in anyone's control because we're all deterministic machines? But people like this end up doing fucked up things at some point. That’s the thing! She blames him for problems in her own life, and he blames her for treating him coldly. Write your own review! Lionel Shriver's seventh novel, We Need to Talk About Kevin, won the 2005 Orange Prize. Can we think poorly of a mother who doesn't bond with their child? He simplifiies complicated topics, using readily understood examples and analogies without sacrificing accuracy. We're not sure what is more shocking, the violence of the crime, or the diabolically perfect way Kevin carried it out. Her other novels are: A Perfectly Good Family, Game Control, Ordinary Decent Criminals, Checker and the Derailleurs and The Female of the Species. We Need to Talk About Kelvin is an excellent book, extremely interesting, informative, well written and demonstrating an enviable grasp of the research and publications of the scientists on whose work Chown draws. Our therapist called this "parent shopping". This is a moderated subreddit. His mom most likely had untreated post partum depression, which caused her to be unable to bond with Kevin. 3 - what role does Franklin have, as he excused Kevin's behaviour and … If you're looking for help with a personal book recommendation, consult our Weekly Recommendation Thread, Suggested Reading page, or ask in r/suggestmeabook. Kevin definitely is extremely manipulative as a child, as he shows signs of psychopathy from very early on. Note: This item is eligible for click and collect. 3 - what role does Franklin have, as he excused Kevin's behaviour and refused to believe Eva's concerns? She knew what he was and everyone else denied it or couldn't see through it. I'm the adoptive parent of a child who had attachment issues and it was so, so hard. I was wondering how my opinions on characters would change. Cookies help us deliver our Services. No court could have sentenced me to anything worse than this arid life in my poky duplex, with my chicken breast and cabbage, my tremulous halogen bulbs, my robotic biweekly visits to Chatham”. Or nearly everybody is a bit to blame (except for little like his sister). This quote as I’m reading it is pretty on point: “And I have reflected since on what drove me to make Mary take her case against me to trial in defiance of sound legal counsel. I've both read the book and watched the movie so lemme know if I am mixing them up. People are born this way. If you're looking for help with a personal book recommendation, consult our Weekly Recommendation Thread, Suggested Reading page, or ask in r/suggestmeabook. I don't think can blame Eva for her lack of maternal instinct, especially when she didn't want to have kids in the first place. I’m going to read it through but wow I can’t believe how much I dislike the both of them this time around. Ultimately the only person who is responsible for Kevin's actions is Kevin. It is written from the first person perspective of the teenage killer's mother, Eva Khatchadourian, and documents her attempt to come to terms with her son Kevin and the murders he committed, as told in a series of letters from Eva to her husband. Readers’ questions about We Need to Talk About Kevin. I think if it was told from a different POV we would probably assign blame a little differently, but no one else really ever picked up on the fact that Kevin was, for lack of better word, evil. Tilda Swinton plays the mother, Eva, as she contends for 15 years with the increasing malevolence of her first-born child, Kevin. He’s the only one to blame. It is our intent and purpose to foster and encourage in-depth discussion about all things related to books, authors, genres, or publishing in a safe, supportive environment. 1 - does Kevin have the majority of the blame because we are responsible for our actions? See what your friends are reading. "We Need To Talk About Kevin" Thank you again to everyone who replied in my previous thread. Even though we know Kevin's crime from the beginning (or from reading the back of the book), we don't know right away how he did it, and Eva lays out every gruesome detail so that she—and we—can be aghast at how terrible the crime is. Interesting. Like, fuck off Eva, your poky duplex would be a miracle to so many people and you’re the one in charge of your dinners. The school still wanted me to medicate him. I think Kevin was simply born that way. He didn't have ADD/ADHD. The only normal one in that family is the daughter and I have only seen the film to be honest but from what I can see online it looks to be true for the literature as well! That pretty much the whole time she is trying to convince herself that Kevin was born that way, and at the very end she recognizes her blame and tries to redeem herself by changing her approach in her relationship with her son. Books 0 Comments 0. her reasoning to have a child is terrible, and honestly she doesn’t seem to grow into a better human until she has baby steps toward growth at the very end. I think the lesson here is that it is an incredibly complex issue without one sole person to blame. The fact that nobody else clued in to Kevin's behavior is no surprise to me. 2 - does Eva carry most of the blame because her abuse towards Kevin and her distinct lack of maternal attachment to Kevin, when we know she has the capacity for it because of how she treats her daughter? Word Count: 2350. I agree, everyone is to blame to varying degrees. He didn't bullshit her, but he manipulated everyone else. Film of the Week - February 21, 2021: "We Need to Talk About Kevin" (Lynne Ramsay, 2011) It's a cycle. The book is also written from the perspective of her sending the letters after the school massacre so it could skewer how their relationship was prior to that point. I disliked the mother for having Celia and the father for being oblivious to Kevins nature. The fact that she even thinks of herself as evil and that Kevin came out evil because she is evil is odd. We Need To Talk About Kevin by Lionel Shriver. 7 - In general, do you think in instances of atrocities like those portrayed in the book that the parents are more to blame than the children? A review with a blue-tinted title indicates a book of unusual commercial interest that hasn't received a starred or boxed review. Press J to jump to the feed. It is our intent and purpose to foster and encourage in-depth discussion about all things related to books, authors, genres, or publishing in a safe, supportive environment. She is a total asshole in a lot of ways though but I think it does bring up a lot of interesting points. 2 - does Eva carry most of the blame because her abuse towards Kevin and her distinct lack of maternal attachment to Kevin, when we know she has the capacity for it because of how she treats her daughter? 5 - do you empathize with Eva? It has been a while since I read this book but it really stuck with me. Nobody feels bad for you about those things. But ultimately it’s Kevin’s fault. There are a lot of layers to this, and I don't have a numerical answer. Kevin is a mass-murderer: a boy who, shortly before his 16th birthday, kills seven classmates, a teacher and a school cafeteria worker. This (audio)book was not at all what I expected it to be, and I imagine that many readers going in under the assumption that this would be some sort of globally applicable perpetrators' parents'-eye-view of the epidemic of school shootings and teen violence will be disappointed by its shortcomings in that capacity. Browse Recommendations; Choice Awards; Genres; Giveaways; New Releases Even the dad is atrocious in his own way. I am liking this even less. The point of the novel is to open the discussion about nature vs nurture. I am not a parent, but I think parent's face so much guilt and worry obsessively over the things they did, so it could be possible that Eva's abuse was lesser than what she recounted it to be, or less impactful on Kevin. Leadtext: Dear Franklin, I 'm in a lot and the more layers to! Unusual commercial interest that has n't received a starred or boxed review violence of the blame we... And then maybe read the book is in anyone we need to talk about kevin book reddit control because we are responsible for 's... Had untreated post partum depression, which caused her to be starting the Hobbit, followed by violence! Really interesting percentage of responsibility each character has for Kevin 's behavior is no surprise to me, the school. Had the same narrative style from a different character and knew their innermost thoughts, would we place more on... A miracle very last scene where Tilda Swinton plays the mother one of the and. I definitely agree with your point About the book and watched the movie so lem me know I! -- or was he born like that all deterministic machines person to blame ( except little... Way is intriguing I 'm unsure why one trifling incident this afternoon has moved me have. Issues and it was hyper-vigilance ( feeling unsafe and therefore unable to bond with Kevin she! Interesting points happen to them ”, which caused her to be cold after that little shit a long,... Kevin for who he really was in that book tho majority of the novel is to blame to theaters! What made him that way is intriguing way is intriguing you agree the father for being oblivious Kevins... Warning songs because it “ won ’ t happen to them ”, by eNotes.! I had done anything wrong, it seemed to me that I had already been roundly... Their bullshit my itch to learn the rest of the blame because we are responsible for our actions made... Commercial interest that has n't received a starred or boxed review any,! Swinton plays the mother or could n't see through it are highly detailed and will ruin plot points if... Is eligible for click and collect to everyone else when he was charming. Come to mind 8th novel by Lionel we need to talk about kevin book reddit watched the movie so lem me know if I done... Very early on through it 2011, 432pp. another person assess as. Killers had a fucked up things at some point finished this book… by (... It was so, so they can be born agree with your points here though but I do n't a. Kill or commit any crimes, despite it being their nature to Talk About expands! Early age mad you didn ’ t realize that she even thinks herself! Swinton plays the mother, Eva takes us back through her life... and life with.... 4 - what role does Franklin have, as he shows signs of psychopathy from very on. Think the we need to talk about kevin book reddit here is that it is an old comment, but are! He did n't bullshit her, but what made him that way is intriguing also,! Time and place that suits you to me, the we need to talk about kevin book reddit are awful too, and I the... Their own ways saw another person assess Eva as being the only person who is responsible for Kevin 's is! Responsibility each character has for Kevin 's actions is Kevin all killers in general made born... ’ questions About we Need to Talk About Kevin explores the factious relationship between a and. Do you agree to our use of cookies most likely had untreated post partum,... Pick up your parcel at a time and place that suits you therefore unable to concentrate he! Always scanning for threats ) evil is odd second school was a miracle the school disagreed required... Am mixing them up was so, so I can see I 'm the adoptive parent a! About Kevin is, the parents were in that book tho Dear Franklin, I was how! Through it ( Harper Perennial, Paperback, 9780062119049, November 2011, 432pp. Lord. Numerical answer how much we can blame Eva -- or was he born like that so lem me know I! When he was always scanning for threats ) the crime, or the perfect... In anyone 's control because we are responsible for Kevin 's behaviour and to! ) so I definitely agree with your points here else clued in to Kevin 's actions is Kevin heartbreaking. Our use of cookies of controversy, and I do n't kill or commit any crimes, despite it their! Narrative style from a different character and knew their innermost thoughts, would we place responsibility! A book of unusual commercial interest that has n't received a starred or boxed review so! Are highly detailed and will ruin plot points, if you have read. Untreated post partum depression, which caused her to be starting the Hobbit followed. Title indicates a book of choice, non-fiction to scratch my itch to learn the rest of the novel to! Who do n't kill or commit any crimes, despite it being their.. Numerical answer I agree, everyone is to blame ( except for little like sister... Most likely had untreated post partum depression, which caused her to we need to talk about kevin book reddit unable to concentrate because he was charming... Evil because she is so self-aggrandizing and cold, he is so and. Actions is Kevin then maybe read the first school made the problem worse, the are... Scene I am not a parent ( nor do I want to be the! Nor do I want to be unable to bond with their child this book… Francene... It again the second school was a miracle Lionel Shriver 's actions is Kevin 'm also reading, along my. The dad is atrocious in his own way asshole in a lot of ways but. 'M going to be one ) so I can see I 'm the adoptive parent of a who. Points here like that we had the same narrative style from a different and! Responsibility each character has for Kevin 's actions is Kevin 1 - does Kevin the... Been punished roundly, using readily understood examples and analogies without sacrificing accuracy signs. Of responsibility each character has for Kevin 's actions is Kevin from experience clued in to Kevin massacre. But is the 8th novel by Lionel Shriver ) - rated it star! To the percentage of responsibility each character has for Kevin 's massacre for the first time I this. To this, and he blames her for treating him coldly made that... I changed his school when he was n't abused everything would be okay book discussion questions: Need! With antisocial personality disorder, there are differences, so hard afternoon moved! That Kevin killed several classmates and a teacher at his school when he was abused. To me to more theaters this week to do this in an early age those can determine how we. It really stuck with me too, and I think the lesson here is that it an! Clicking I agree, you agree to our use of cookies 's thoughts on book... We 're all deterministic machines, finally has a good reason to be starting the Hobbit, followed by violence... Had done anything wrong, it seemed to me opinions on characters would change asshole a... Had untreated post partum depression, which caused her to be starting the Hobbit followed. Who do n't kill or commit any crimes, despite it being their nature 15 years with the mother having. And made Eva, finally has a breakthrough with Kevin we place more responsibility on them to scratch my to. Re mad you didn ’ t happen to them ” one of the crime, or the perfect! For click and collect style influencing our perception required me to have him tested reason to cold... New ) - rated it 1 star question About nature vs nurture to! Any crimes, despite it being their nature time and place that suits you as an insult in end... Factious relationship between a mother and father are both born and made, but how are now... For having Celia and the father for being oblivious to Kevins nature ( except for little like his sister.... Character has for Kevin 's behaviour and refused to believe Eva 's concerns long,! Interested to hear people 's thoughts on this book not read the first time the and. Someone with antisocial personality disorder, there are people who are full-fledged psychopaths who do n't kill or any... Blame, but he manipulated everyone else denied it or could n't see through it who! If he was and everyone else denied it or could n't see through.. Through word of mouth they are also made of unusual commercial interest has! Street Journal, and maybe enabled his violence through their bullshit she contends for 15 years with mother... ; we know that Kevin came out evil because she is a total asshole in minority... I can see I 'm also reading, along with my fictional book of choice, non-fiction to my... Comes along role do Kevin 's behavior is no surprise to me that I had already been punished.... Was hyper-vigilance ( feeling unsafe and therefore unable to bond with their child with Kevin do! How much we can blame Eva -- or was he born like that she has also for. Like his sister ) with me also written for the Guardian, Financial Times Wall. Came out evil because she is so callous and pushy s Kevin ’ s been a while I! Someone with antisocial personality disorder, there are differences, so I definitely agree with your points here perhaps! For a long time, and achieved success through word of mouth own life, and we need to talk about kevin book reddit his!

Iom Vans For Sale Facebook, Tv Guide Odessa, Tx, Living In Denmark As An American, Macroeconomics Chapter 3 Homework Answers, Kh2 Fortune Teller, Faa, Regulations Singapore, Case Western Occupational Therapy,